When to Fold ’Em?
Lots of people have asked me this over the past year. “If my partner is moving away, is leaving me, when should I give up? How do I make that decision?” I did write one article on how to get ‘em to make a decision about joining you in a relationship. This article is based on the same principle involving a person who maybe acting passively at a time when you want some decision. And remember this is all based on your continued wish to reconnect.
The decision you want is a) that your partner decides to come back toward you or b) that you reasonably get to stop waiting for them.
Here is the setup. They have moved out, either physically or emotionally or both. Their actions have led you to understand that the previous relationship you had with them somehow “sucked” – enough for them to leave. So now you don’t want the old relationship back, but do want to make a new and better relationship with them. You have read my article on What to do when he/she leaves and are trying to follow the four steps.
So the question is, “How long do you wait?” The current wisdom out on the internet seems to be to not contact them at all. I do not think that a wise course. No contact may make them become aware of their “loneliness,” but also may communicate that you don’t care – that you want them to go away.
So here is my suggestion. Modify this as you chose. In its pure form it takes 5 months.
- Establish a contact channel: email, or cards are ideal. It should be cheap and easily permit the sending of a very limited amount of information. I find text messaging is not very suited to this, nor is voice mail, but you choose. You want them to receive your contact and have perfect freedom about what they do with it: read it, trash it, etc.
- Plan a message that you are going to send. You may have to send as many as 10, so make this simple. The message should contain a “greeting,” an optional bit of news, a clue to your work on yourself, a gentle invitation for more contact.
- The greeting can be nothing more complex than “Hi,” or “Dear Mike,” etc. Keep this light.
- Optional newsy bit is just something like “It’s raining hard,” “The lilacs are out,” “Broke my leg the other day. Doing ok, tho.” Don’t mention anything awful that they might feel obliged to fix. Don’t ever say, “I’m miserable without you,” or the like.
- The clue to your work on yourself is part of my instruction to “3: Work on yourself visibly.” This should be different in each note, and I think these should be pretty abstract. You want your partner to be curious for more. Some examples are, “Seeing my counselor weekly and I am sure learning a lot,” “Wow am I learning about how pushy I used to be.” “Boy, I am getting it that I have been asleep for years.” Etc. Anything you are learning that might involve some subject of their past “complaints” might be good. An example could be that if they complained about your temper, you say, “I am working really hard on getting rid of my anger. I realized it’s been a problem to me for years.”
- Lastly you include a gentle invitation (not a push) to more contact. “Love to hear from you any time you feel like it,” “It’d be fun to hear your voice.” “If you ever feel like contacting me, feel free.” (I strongly suggest you don’t ask questions. None, if you can. Just gentle invitations.)
- Then sign it, bluntly or not at all. “Dave,” “Yours,” etc. Do not say, “Your most obedient and humble servant, begging for your orders, please, please.”
- Send one message only, once a week for one month. (4 messages) Send one message, once every other week for two months. (4 messages) Send one message, once a month for two months. (2 messages) STOP.
That’s it.
If at any time he/she re-contacts you, follow my rule #4 and respond minimally. Oh, if their contact is neutral or simply newsy, read it and ignore it. The contact you are looking for is some request to connect to you coming from them. Example: if they say, “Life is crazy here,” you might feel an impulse to write back something like, “What’s going on?” Don’t do it! It’s a trap. If they say, “Tell me more about what you are learning,” that’s a move to reconnect. Respond minimally to that. Wait for them to be explicit.
Do not be surprised too much if he/she contacts you after the five months of this process. Your partner is leaving that period with a memory of your wanting them, but not pushing. That, I think, is the best you can do.
Good luck.
Hey Al,
Been reading your articles. What would be your best advice if the girl simply fell out of love? We were together for 2 years
Im sure falling out of love is caused by many reasons. But in my case it was my behavior, i was clingy, possessive, controlling, and needy. Im sure she’s happy im out of her life and probably feels a weight lifted off her shoulder. Our breakup has almost been a month. I did some begging and pleading. We did take a one week “break” but that sure just wasnt enough. We broke up again within 3 weeks because she felt that nothing was going to change. What should I do?
Two years is a nice length for the Romantic Period of a relationship, seems to me. (Check out my Map of Relationships as that is my reference when thinking of where a couple is and where to go next.) That “falling out of love” seems to be an experience that everyone goes through – everyone. So I would take it simply as a signpost along the way, something like a sign saying “Detroit 21 miles.” It doesn’t signify any problem and lets you know you are on the way.
Now that phrase “felt that nothing was going to change” is a much more serious signal. Somehow your partner had accepted her growing list of the “problems with you” and had kept imagining that you would change over time. But somehow she’s gotten to feel “hopeless” of change and has come to believe you are stuck. Since we humans are all about learning, growing, and changing, this observation of her (he won’t change) is seriously worth looking at.
I think I would seek and find the “truthy” parts of her observation, and change them in ways that she can see. You’ve got some nice clues: clingy, possessive, needy (read my papers on Reliable Membership); and controlling (read on Controlling). I had all those problems, myself.
Good luck.
My husband moved to his parents house. We have been together for 12 years, married for almost 9. He said he wants to start marriage counseling, but when I scheduled an appointment, he said “he’s done trying to make it work.” I don’t feel he ever tried. He thought I was controlling, so I am working on that about myself and informed him albeit briefly of my progress. He has done nothing but say mean comments to me. He also left his ring when he left. I think the main issue with him is he’s been under a lot of stress financially. He has not been able to keep a job for more than a few months before he either quits or gets laid off. I have always supported him during these rough times, even researching job opportunities for him. I think he just doesn’t want the responsibility of being married. He tends to run away from his problems, blaming them on everyone but himself. Now he blames me. I cannot afford to stay at our house by myself, so I will be moving back to my parents at the end of the month if he does not return. How do I handle this situation?
Ok, Amy, you’ll handle it as best you can. But at least you are at a new starting place. People who tend to be controlling often marry people who don’t want responsibility. Heck, everyone wants to be a baby and have no responsibility. It is the lessons of life that force us to take on the responsibilities we have to. Get ahold of your tendencies to act Controlling and build Boundaries as quickly as you can. (you both’ll need ’em if you live with your parents!)
I’ve heard that “I’m done trying to make it work” line many times. On one level it means he’s tired. On another it means that when he hears “work” out of your mouth, he hears awful things. Controlling people are a pain in the tush to their partner, and often don’t know it till their partner leaves.
Good luck.
Hi Al,
I’ve just discovered your site and have been finding it very helpful. Currently I feel like I’m in limbo and would really love and appreciate your opinion. I’ll try to keep this short and to the point. My ex boyfriend (my first love) ended our relationship around 3/4 weeks ago now. We’d been together for almost four years. This past year we have been living together. He said his feelings had changed and that he didn’t want our relationship anymore. A week later he admitted that there is someone else he likes and she likes him too. These past weeks I’ve been reflecting and realise what the issues were in the last 6 months and these are things that I will definitely be working on. I have been having issues with anxiety and have dealt with a lot this year so have been feeling depressed. He had a change of job which is extremely demanding on our time together, at times I felt his job was pulling him away from our relationship. As a result of these issues sometimes I took a lot out on him. He admitted to me sometimes I made him feel unwanted and like I didn’t appreciate him. This breaks my heart as he means the world to me and my behaviour has mainly been the result of a tough year and various issues. I wish that he had spoken to me as it might have been what we needed. But instead he kept these feelings to himself as he didn’t want to upset me. My stuff is still in our home and boxed up. I’ve been staying with my Mum whilst looking for somewhere else to live.
We’ve been keeping in contact on and off as we would like to remain friends. On a few occassions I have told him that we should maybe stop contact for a while as eventually he may be in a relationship with this woman. But he persists and truly believes we can be friends and even gets a bit upset about it. I feel that it’s easier for him as he’s the one who has moved on. The problem for me is I feel like there are some mixed messages. I love him and would like to work together and move forward but its clear that he doesn’t want to be together and of course there is someone else. Yet when we see one another there is a clear connection between us. He’s affectionate and is constantly trying to cuddle me, or give me a kiss on the cheek. Even when I tell him that he shouldn’t and that it makes it hard for me. He says that there are still feelings there but its simply because we were together for four years and that it’s just friendly behaviour. He is regularly initiating contact with me through texting and today even suggested me popping over to the house as he said it would be nice to see me. When he contacts me, most of the time – aside from the odd argument and bitter remarks, I remain positive, upbeat and try to come across happy.
I’ve learnt to not push or pursue and to work on myself. I’ve definitely learnt a lot and in a strange way this has given me the push to work on myself and on the things in my life that were making me unhappy. But I don’t know where to go from here. I don’t want to give up on what we had, I believe he’s the one for me and he is my best friend. Should I keep in contact with him and keep making positive changes for myself but remain hopeful? Or should I cut contact for a while and try to move on? I feel that maybe if he wasn’t as affectionate or pursuing contact as often that things would be clearer, whereas at the moment I feel like theres hope and that he does still feel something. Advice from friends and family is mixed – I can’t seem to make up my mind. I’m scared that I’m holding on and that I will just end up getting hurt.
I should probably also add that he is close to being in a relationship with this new woman. They’ve been spending a lot of time together and he’s told me that although it’s not official they are kind of seeing one another now.
All that means that he enjoys the time with her, the types of chats. He still had quite an investment of time with you. He’ll have trouble with her. At that point you want to prove that you are the gal (of the two of you) who is working on fixing troubles. Relationships aren’t built one day, they are built over years – repeated finding problems and addressing them.
Your first bit, Ness, about being in “limbo” woke me up. One of my guidelines is “If you want to be sure, go inside.” You want this guy, then work on it. But chose the work carefully. If you still have contact, any contact, then continually work to improve that contact. He’s pulled away cuz there are things in that connection that suck for him. Show that you are addressing those concerns of his while taking care of yourself. Read on.
Thank you for your response. It’s just heartbreaking as I know there is someone else and he has told me she makes him happy. I should prepare myself for the fact that they may be official very soon as it sounds like it’s heading that way. I know he likes her. Watching him move on is torture but even so I’m still not ready to give up and let go, am I an idiot? I’ve decided to keep in contact with him but to avoid seeing him in person for at least a month as this is where I struggle. I hope that if I’m meant to move on I can do so whilst having him as a friend as the thought of losing him completely is soul destroying. Thanks again Al
Well, Ness, it’s worth a bunch of grieving whenever dreams crash. Still at this point I think it is worth remembering that you (unintentionally) earned this situation. Had you learned a whole bunch of things, you know now, earlier this probably would not be happening. And there’s a lot more to learn. Looking for the “wise things to do” is a great pursuit. If you read my Map of Relationships, you will probably be able to anticipate that he’ll have trouble with his new gal, but maybe you can even anticipate what kinds of trouble he’ll have. And maybe you can learn the wise ways of handling those troubles, which she probably won’t.
Anyway, good luck.
Hi. We have a totally the same situation and I would like to know how you are and how you’re handling this. I’m desperate for an answer. I don’t know what to do anymore. 🙁
Hi Lily,
As cliche as it sounds- time has helped. I do still love him and miss him. I think about him a lot but it honestly does get easier and more bearable as time passes. There were a lot of down days in the first month or so which is normal but eventually things did get easier and I feel like a much stronger person. I had days of anger, bitterness and frustration. Lots of tears. Then I tried to keep myself busy and around people that I can talk to and to help distract me. And I tried to stop myself from thinking about him with her.
i was getting a lot of mixed messages (still am!) from my ex which has made it harder for me to accept that it’s over, that’s why I would recommend giving yourself some space and minimising if not cutting contact for a while until you work out what you want to do- you’ll find it helps. I wish Id had the strength to do this sooner.It took me months to do this but I find having contact with him at the moment sets me back a bit! I used to constantly check things like facebook and that- you have to remove those connections to stop yourself from obsessing because it’ll drive you insane! Ignorance is bliss. It’s been a heartbreaking time for me, but I promise you it does get easier. I’ve learnt to take each day as it comes – what will be will be one way or another. keep busy and focus on yourself x
Thank you for replying. It’s been 3 months since we broke up, yes it does get better, I no longer cry every night because I’m missing her(we were on a same sex relationship), I no longer text and call her tons of times a day, in fact I blocked her number so she can’t call me buy I still receive her texts in my spam. I tried the No contact rule but it only lasted for as long as 3 weeks. We’ve only seen each other 3 times since the break up and it did help a lot because we used to live together and her not being around made it a bit easier. The problem is she wants us to remain bestfriends and I also want us to be friends but she is dating someone now. And the harder part is, she met her when we were still together so I feel betrayed and cheated. I’ve tried being her friend for some time, right now we are still communicating like “bestfriends” and it’s sending me very mixed signals because we still say “I love you” and other things we say to each other when we we’re still together. She doesnt want to cut contact and during the no contact period she texts and calls a lot, said she missed me so much. I know she still loves me and she still cares. She said she doesnt want to lose me forever and the only way for that to happened is if we remain bestfriends. I don’t know what to do anymore. It hurts to be just her friend when I know she’s dating someone else. I still have hope that she will want me back but should I?
I’ve had the exact same issue, Ive explained to him that I can’t be his friend right now as it hurts. But he texts and I struggle to ignore it. When ive seen him there’s still a strong connection and he’s made a move on several occasions! But he also says he’d like to be friends and doesn’t want to lose me completely but the thing is it’s easier for them as they’re the ones who’s feelings have changed. I’ve tried to be his friend on and off in the hope that he’ll want to be together again but all I’m doing is hurting myself. He also met this girl whilst with me and I feel very betrayed and hurt. You need the distance. In a way its selfish of them to expect an immediate friendship after a heartbreaking rejection! I’ve convinced myself I could do it on and off for months but I find when I keep in contact I think about him more and long for what we had.
Maybe she will want you back but waiting around for that hope is going to cause you a lot of pain. Try to move on that’s what I’m doing. I tell myself that if he wants me back in the future then we will go from there but letting go is key. You have to do what’s best for you. It’s a difficult situation and hard to accept the change. No one knows what the future will hold but at the moment you need to look after yourself and it does hurt being a part of their life knowing they’re with someone else, it eats you up. I hope eventually after some time and distance I can be his friend (and again who knows) but I recognise making myself do that right now will only make it harder on myself.
That’s what I want to do, to stop communication but im afraid that she’ll forget about me, find a new bestfriend in this other girl and that she’ll longer love me in any way. Should I try this 5 steps process in this article or totally just cut contact? I’ve tried no contact for as long as 3 weeks but it only made us miss each other but didnt change her mind, didnt make me want her less. It just made us both sad. The no contact stopped because it was New Year and I just couldnt help myself greet her. I wonder what would have happened if I continued not contacting her. I really do want to move on, but something in me still wants her back because I know she still loves me. I’m conflicted. 🙁
I tell you, Lily, i’m not in favor of NC. There is something of meanness and punishment in it. Taking a break for an announced period of time (TimeOut) does seem good.
Also once you’ve connected with someone, the only way to move on really involves finding someone else to connect with. I believe we are really not designed to live alone, but we don’t seem trained to live with either. Poor training can be fixed.
Good luck.
Can I really move on if I keep in contact with her? Since I stopped texting her, she texts me every morning to tell me to be safe when going to work. I don’t know why she’s doing this. Sometimes I want to reply but then if I do, I won’t be able to stop myself from feeling everything again. If I don’t do NC how often should I contact her? And how do I make her feel that I still love and want her without being so needy? I want her to realize if she really wants me gone or what because I feel she doesnt want me to move on and i think she’s not sure if she really love this new person she’s dating. I want her to be sure.
This is the problem ive had, I’ve tried to give myself distance and time away to work on myself and to try and move on. It’s not been easy but it’s small steps. I’ve felt as if all ive done is wait around hoping he will change his mind. This has been painful for me. I explained to him that I needed space and he seems convinced we can be friends it’s like at the moment we want different things and in a way I think he struggles to understand why I need space. I know we miss one another and think about one another and obviously care but I just recognise I can’t put myself through this merry go round anymore. I think you should do what you feel is best, and don’t feel stuck and pressured in to sticking to following steps or to no contact for a period of time. I personally try and take each day as it comes and go from there. I still hope one day we will be together again, or that we can in the future be friends I just know I can’t be his friend at the moment. Not to punish him but to protect myself from tormenting myself and being unable to move on. its normal to be afraid of those things, but it’s not just down to you and you can’t control her feelings or desires so looking after yourself is important.
Thank you. I guess I’ll just have to live my life as happy as possible. I don’t want to live each day being miserable hoping we’ll be together again. If we’re really meant to be we’ll be togethet right? I’ll just focus on myself right now, how to be a better version of myself. I’m travelling solo for the first time this week, soul searching I guess, maybe it’ll help me see things clearly. Right now I’m ignoring her texts and I won’t come to our friends’ get together because I know she’ll be there, I’m just not ready to face her yet. I just hope that no matter what the end may be, if she’ll come back as my girlfriend or my bestfriend, I won’t mind as long as she comes back to me and that I’m ready to accept whatever it is. I just can’t lose her. She’ll always be a part of me. I will always love her.
You’re welcome 🙂 enjoy your travels I’m sure it will help a lot and give you that time to yourself which is really empowering in times like these! I know how you feel, I honestly feel the same. I still very much love my ex and can’t imagine a life without him, I just recognise what I can and can’t handle right now. It’s very hard to stick to things, each day I find I feel differently. But I try not to be hard on myself either, it all takes time. Taking some space and looking after yourself doesn’t mean you’ll lose her, if she wants to be a part of your life and you want that to then it will happen. Good luck with everything 🙂
Goodluck too Ness. It’s really comforting to know someone feels exactly what I’m feeling that I’m not alone. If you’d like, we can still talk to each other, maybe help each other in a more personal manner. Feel free to message me on facebook http://www.facebook.com/archangelval. I would love to hear from you. Our situation is so similar I feel there’s no one better to talk to than someone who’s exactly in my shoes.
Al, Thanks for creating this website some useful things… I was hoping I could get your opinion on my situation…
my girlfriend and I recently broke up after 5 years together. To give a little run-down, we met as co-workers 5 years during a summer job and really had a romantic and passionate first year together. We’ve never had any shortage of passion, but after our first year together we got jobs in the mid-west as school teachers in the city. This was a stressful time for both of us as we made the jump to professional careers in a difficult setting. I often was stressed and poured my all into my work much to her detriment. Needless to say we had a up and down few years together and looking back, much of our relationship could be characterized as symptomatic of the “power struggle” each of kind of resorting to different tactics to get the love that we want in the relationship. As I reflect, I often felt disrespected in our relationship since it was kind of founded on a summer romance where there was some deceit and infidelity early on because we didn’t really anticipate it switching from a summer romance to a long-term relationship. However, during the relationship I wasn’t really able to identify that I often felt disrespected and I would often become angry / frustrated as a result of not being able to effectively communicate with her and I would pour myself into external pursuits (hobbies) and my career in order to seek fulfillment through those outlets, I guess you can call them relational exits. She on the other hand, also tried different tactics to kind of get the love she wanted, pressing in, pulling away, a couple periods of uncertainty where we almost broke-up because she was tired of the relationship being so much work, despite that I know she really loved or loves me. Everything is clearer in hindsight as it goes and I feel like we essentially grew up together.
On my part, the relationship is characterized as me mistreating her at times. Not giving her the attention / treatment that she deserved, not being very communicative, supportive, and open with compliments, and sometimes when angry – I would say things that I didn’t mean, though this wasn’t often. I think what kept it going is our very compatible dynamic, life goals, shared friend circles, dogs, intelligence, and just an overall enjoyment of each other when things were going well.
Anyhow, at the 4 year mark – she cheated on me and owned up to it and was very remorseful over it. She said she did it because she was feeling emotionally weak and though we had a period of uncertainty we ultimately decided to continue the relationship, though we probably didn’t go about healing the relationship in the way that we should’ve. I felt guilty for letting her get to that point, but much of the focus was on her misdeed when getting back together instead of how we could fundamentally improve what was knocking us off course which I believe to be a fundamental rift in communication.
So we reconciled and she committed to moving halfway across the country with me so that I could attend a grad program in the West. It is a phd program and I basically spent this entire last year immersed in my studies, with no time to really work on my own flaws and no time to really give her what she needed. Much of the last year could be characterized by her really picking up my slack and me often feeling worn down and stressed out, and oftentimes taking this stress out on her. Additionally, she was expecting a marriage proposal and brought it up many times this past year, but I was on a different timeline and anticipated proposing this year. I think she was quite discouraged by this. Over the last 6 months, the stress added up, and we were both kind of frustrated with where we were at with the relationship, and since she’s a school teacher she planned on going home for the summer which would give her time with her family and would give me more time to focus on my studies. Her going home had nothing to do with our relationship at the time, it was a vacation with her. Although, while she was home, our communication got worse as I was quite stressed with school work, and when she came back from her vacation she decided to break up with me. She did so in a pretty aggressive manner, said some mean things, and moved into a place across town. I was pretty blind-sided by this and was extremely hurt, I know things were bad w/ my current stress level due to school, but I thought we were both in it for the long haul. Needless to say this has prompted hard introspection and a quite a bit of reflection on what I want out of life and how I’ve acted over years. It has been humbling and I feel as though it has forced me to grow quite a bit in a short period of time.
At this point in the break-up, it has been 3 months, I sent her a lot of emails initially and did the whole begging and pleading until she told me to back off and I did just that. Since she told me to back off, I sent her two emails, each being about 3 weeks apart, so I guess it’s been about 3 weeks “NC”. Although, she has never communicated with me during this entire process other than to tell me to back off. I feel pretty broken by this and I don’t know how to move forward, I have no option other than to leave her alone and focus on myself, but I would like to think there is light at the end of the tunnel. I really love this woman and would love nothing more than just to sit down and have a conversation with her and let know what this period apart has brought about in my reflection. We’re both in our late 20s and I know she has wanted marriage, even mentioning it up until 2 weeks before breaking up with me. I want marriage and a family as well, though its not looking very good as far as anything at this point. When she broke up with me she kinda showed both sides of the coin, on one hand she said, I love you and I would really need to proof of change in the future if there is a chance in the future, and she alluded to potentially getting back at some point in the future. Though on the other hand, she also said that I don’t deserve hope and told me she doesn’t see a future with me. I kind of poured my heart in some of the emails and was eager early on to take all the blame on myself, so I don’t know if this did either of us any favors by validating her actions. Additionally, I know that she told some mutual friends that she doesn’t see a future with me in the wake of the break-up, though I’m not sure whether to chalk this up to her being angry. Overall, I think the break-up has brought about positive growth, but I want to believe there’s a silver lining between her and I. I want marriage and a family with her, and I have a bright future ahead of me with my career path, so I don’t know if she’ll look back.
I think the cheating is evidential that she’s been frustrated with relationship for awhile, though I do really believe that she loves me. The breakup was quite confusing at first, especially since she had moved here for me. Her vacation was actually a vacation that she planned for awhile regardless of our situation, but I definitely see the validity in that it ended up serving as a launching pad for the break-up. I was kind of overwhelming her with my stress even while she was away, and I pushed her too far. I mean I would like to get back together if its salvageable and though I plan on staying no contact, I am tempted just to ask for some closure or just to decompress things. I’m sick of living with this tension and dissonance of thinking of her as a dark spell on my life in order to move on. Maybe that works for her in order to get over me, but I just don’t think it’s healthy. I mean she left me as though I’d slept with her sister or something, and hasn’t talked to me since. I mean she obviously had to be angry at the time in order to get the momentum to go through with it, but 3 months out it just leaves a negative void.
I’m struggling with this – I haven’t tried to contact her in about a month and a half and its been 3 months since the breakup in total. I found that she recently created an online dating profile w/ some rather provocative things in it. This is rather hurtful that she’s putting herself out there so quickly and appearedly not taking more time to figure herself out and reflect. I’m at a loss, should I try to contact her or do I just sit here in silence? I am trying to be positive through this, but I am also not trying to maintain false hope. Although, it is hard to turn off the switch on hope.
Thanks if youve read this.
Well, Anon or rdevine, it is tough. Lots for you to learn and I think you are learning it. Keep reading the stuff on my website. I would not put a month between contacts. Probably 2 weeks. But then you have to make those contacts really simple. Remember, she’s gotten to think you are hopeless – a couple of times. She still wants a relationship, just not the kind you two have been doing up til now. Check out my paper on “When to Fold Em” to get an idea of how to contact her. Good luck.
Would that contact rule work if he has filed for divorce and the last time I actually talked to him he walked away and said if I had questions talk to his lawyer. That was over a month ago, we were together 27 years, married 24, been separated about 6 months.
Yep. I think all the principles still apply. Sounds as if my Map of Relationships is still the place to start when planning a new beginning. Good luck.